Dallas native Ben Kweller is an interesting tangle of contradictions. He's 26, but his first major label album was released a decade ago. Kweller is an indie rock star, but lives in a Brooklyn brownstone with his longtime wife and young son. And his music is accessible and catchy, yet it hasn't quite found the large audience it deserves. Kweller returns to the Austin City Limits Festival for two shows this weekend to bounce back after a severe allergy attack during his 2006 set had him bleeding profusely throughout his abbreviated show. We decided to skip asking him about the tampon in the nose, but Austinist did talk to Kweller about being a dad, finding an audience, and relocating to Austin (or not).

Hey, Ben, it's always good to see you roll back into Austin.

Well, you know, it's my favorite festival that we play, and we try to do it as much as possible. I'm just hoping I can get away without a bunch of blood this year, obviously! We're making some special T-shirts with blood stains on them, so the kids can pick that up as a souvenir. We're trying to think of a good slogan, like "I Survived ACL Without Bleeding" or we'll put a tampon picture on them or something.

So let's start with last year's ACL debacle. How the hell did you make it through 30 minutes of that gig? We were watching you, and it was even painful for us.

I know one thing: when you're on stage, performing is a different bag. I don't know how it is for everyone, but I've talked to other friends who are performers, and they say the same things. We all feel like you could break your leg during a show and you wouldn't even feel it. For me, it was more the pain of choking on the blood, because I couldn't get my words out. That was the real pain in the ass. If I was just bleeding up there, and I had been able to sing...I wasn't in pain. I guess it's similar to wondering how Iggy Pop cuts himself or Marilyn Manson or any of those guys, you know? You don't really feel it on stage. But there wasn't much pain involved, it was more of just a nuisance. And I was bumming because it was such a big show for me, and I'd been looking forward to it. I always look forward to ACL, and it was my first year on the main stage. So it was a big show, and I got that damn nosebleed like an hour and a half before the gig, and we thought it would be alright. I've had nosebleeds in the past, you know, like when you're a kid and you pick your nose! (Laughs) But this thing was a freak, and the doctor said it was probably from the air conditioner on our bus. I don't know if you've spent time on tour buses, but most people love the A/C on full blast. After a week or two of that, it's almost like you've been on an airplane the whole time. My throat is really sensitive to temperature changes, and obviously my nose is, too.

Well, plus you're going from that icebox to like 101 degrees when you're playing outside in Texas in September.

Totally. And Austin's the allergy capitol of the world, and so who knows what the hell happened. But I remember talking to (Tom Petty guitarist) Mike Campbell at the Four Seasons after the gig, and he said: "It's those goddamn A/C's! Bob Dylan taught us early on that when you're in your bus, you've gotta roll with the windows down!" So apparently Tom Petty and all those old-schoolers just ride with the windows cranked open. I never knew there was this underlying humidity issue with singers, but there is!

Around that time, you said on KUT that you were considering a move to Austin. Did the allergies take us out of the running?

Man...no, it didn't, and I would move there in a heartbeat. But we kind of got stuck in that trap where you're always thinking: "We'll do this once we move, or when we find the perfect place to settle down." So it was about waiting, then one day moving to Austin. So you kind of put things off, and with the tour schedule, it just started to seem like moving cross-country would be such a pain. We've been in Brooklyn for nine years, and we really are lucky. We're in a great neighborhood - well, it wasn't great nine years ago. But six years ago we bought a brownstone down there near Red Hook, which has always been a really artsy neighborhood, but also a pretty shady one for years and years. All of our friends thought we were crazy because it was a rough part of town. But I was able to get a whole house for the price of an apartment. So for us it made sense, and now there's a Starbucks and a yoga studio down the street because of gentrification. So we got really a cool place, and now with the baby there's a lot of families. We've made a lot of friends with people who have kids Dorian's age, and Liz has other moms to hang out with. And I know we would have that in Austin, too, but right now it seems like we can't make the move. When we were home for a while before this tour, Liz said: "Why don't we just stop dreaming about the future and live for the moment? Let's just be in Brooklyn, and finally hang our family photos on the walls, and just stop worrying." So I was cool with that. I hope that we'll be in Texas again at some point, and if we do that, it'll be in Austin, no doubt.

How did you decide to work with Gil Norton on the new record? And did he talk you into playing everything solo, or was that your idea?

With the new album, I knew that I wanted to work with a heavy-hitter producer. For years, I put together lists of people, thinking it would be cool to work with Gil Norton or Butch Vig, one of those guys. So we sent him the demos for this last album, and he really loved it, and got on the phone with me and we just hit it off. I went out to London to meet with him and we just decided to do it. Originally it was going to be a band record like all my others, and I had a few friends lined up to play on it. But two weeks before the recording began, I was back in London brainstorming ideas with Gil and talking about the material. So we were in his kitchen, drinking tea, and I said: "You know, when I did the drums on this song for the demo..." And he said, "What do you mean?" And he realized that I had played all the instruments. I had recorded the demos at my friend's house, so I went in and banged 'em out really quick to get a sketch down on tape. So it made sense at the time to just do it myself. So Gil said, "Wait! This is how you're got to do the record. You should play everything. I didn't know you could do that." So it was this whole new concept out of left field that I didn't really expect. The studio time was already booked, and at first, I was like: "God, I don't know." I was nervous, and had already promised some of my best friends that they were going to play on it, so there were a bunch of issues. There was also the issue of convincing ATO Records that I could handle it. Understandably, when someone is giving you money to make something, they want everything to work out. So for an artist to say, "well, guys, I'm just going to do this all by myself," it definitely takes a lot of backing. (Laughs) But that's why I'm lucky to be on ATO, because they've always let me follow my vision. They've been nervous sometimes in the past, but luckily everything has worked out. They'll tell me their thoughts, but they want me to steer the ship. So I called Gil back and said yes, and we were both really excited. One of the main things that got us going was that he had always worked with full bands, like The Pixies and The Foo Fighters and all that. He had never been in the studio one-on-one with anybody, and neither had I. We loved the idea of just being in the studio alone, working on music. And it certainly got rid of that "too many cooks in the kitchen" syndrome. So it was my direct vision on tape, and I love that about this album.

Is it ever frustrating as an artist to write catchy rock songs, yet not fit into many people's ideas of what's programmed on popular radio formats?

It has been frustrating for me at times, because all the way from when I put out my first album Sha Sha, I felt that there were singles on that album that never really got to see their full potential. Like "Falling." That song sticks out to me the most - I always thought that it was a hit song and should've been a single. I still think it is.

If it makes you feel any better, we played that song during our wedding reception.

Are you serious? Man, that's so cool, thank you. But that's the kind of story I want to hear. I would rather hear that than have a businessman come and say: "Congratuations, Ben, on your Top 5 Triple A hit this week." You know, what does that really mean to me? But radio is frustrating as hell, and I can't try to predict what's gonna be a hit. That would be the worst thing. You've just gotta do your thing. I thought this new record had some songs that really should've been on the radio as well. But radio is such a strange animal, I just at this point in my career - I can't even think about it. I'm convinced that the day that I record a song or make an album without ever thinking about radio...that's when I'm gonna have my biggest hit. I kind of saw that on this last album, with the video for "Penny On The Train Track" with my grandmother dancing. That was the cheapest video I've ever made - it was $500. And that is my most successful video - it made it all the way to "TRL," which, who would've thought I would be on "TRL"? But my grandma was! But all of that just goes with what the Ben Kweller album represents - it's Murphy's Law. When you don't care, great things will happen. But the second you try hard, they don't. It's really weird.

Is it frustrating when you work on a project and critics or even peers don't like it as much as you?

Well, if they said they don't get it or they didn't know what I was going for, I'd mind that a lot less than if they just said it sucks and gave me one star! (Laughs) That's the worst thing on God's green earth! 'Cause if you don't get it, that kind of says that maybe you'll listen again, and it could grow on you. But like radio, I've had to make a vow with myself not to get caught up in what people think of my music - because it is my music. I make it for others to hear, and I love it when people like my music - and that's what I focus on.

(At this point, there's some noise in the background and the line starts clicking, and Ben disappears for a minute.)

Sorry. I heard [Ben's son] Dorian talking on my phone, so I think he was trying to call me! He does that. He calls people - the other day he called Ryan Adams at like 6am, 'cause that's the first name in my phone's address book. (Laughs) So I guessed he just pressed talk!

I'll see what you mean soon - we have a three month old baby in the house right now.

Oh, I know. Three months, that's so fragile! And they'll still feel fragile for like nine or ten months. Once they're a year old, they're definitely more robust. Dorian's 14 months old, and he's running around, and jumping - his new thing is to crawl up on things, and then jump. He'll just crawl up on a chair and start bouncing. It's the most scary thing ever. And when he was crawling, he was really good at going up the stairs, then turning around and crawling down carefully. But now that he's walking and seeing us walk down stairs, he'll go upstairs and just walk right off of them! He just wants to go forward and downstairs, and he just doesn't get it. You know, you make some progress, and then wham, you take two steps back. It's so funny. For a while there, there were four words he was saying, and now it's just "Mama" again. I've heard that once they learn a skill in that first year, like how to wave, and they master it - then they stop doing it. And then they move on to new things. So the parents are going "why won't you wave bye bye?" But they don't feel like it! They're on to new stuff.

You've toured over the years with everyone from Eels to Death Cab to Gomez to Kings Of Leon. Was there ever another band's audience that totally "got" your music and was a perfect double bill?

There was a tour that I did in the beginning of my solo career when I got signed to ATO that I know made me the majority of my fanbase. Maybe my whole fanbase. And that was when I toured with a band I had never heard of called Dashboard Confessional. That was in 2001, and I remember my booking agent saying that kids were showing up at 11am to line up around the block for their gigs. And that these kids knew every word to the songs. And at that point, they were playing to no more than 1,000 people per night, but the energy in those rooms was amazing. And Chris Carrabba really dug my record I made before I got signed (Freak Out, It's Ben Kweller), and invited me out on the road twice. The first time I was just by myself and acoustic, and the second time I was with the Sha Sha band. So as far as an opening slot, I've never done anything better. We would play to 1,000 kids, and sell 300 CD's in a night. So there were crazy percentages of kids walking away as huge Ben Kweller fans. That's the kind of thing you don't see much as an opening act. So I owe a lot to Chris Carrabba. They've obviously gotten big and mainstream and had radio hits, but it was a great time during those club days. Their fans were rabid, and I was really able to capitalize on that and win over a lot of kids. Also, early tours with The Strokes were also a blast, and I think I got a lot of fans from them. But that tour was more memorable because of the hang, and watching them play every night, and days off together in strange towns. But the Dashboard thing was huge.

Ben Kweller will perform at the Austin City Limits Festival on Saturday, September 15th at 3:15 on the Austin Kiddie Limits stage, and on Sunday, September 16th at 2:30pm for grownups.

[Ben Kweller Official Site]
[Ben Kweller MySpace]

Image via Ben Kweller's MySpace page. Photographer uncredited.